Solveig Multimedia Forum - Get help for video editing software

SolveigMM End-User Products => Video Splitter => Topic started by: snapcoyote on May 16, 2012, 05:53:49 AM

Title: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: snapcoyote on May 16, 2012, 05:53:49 AM
I'm using the batchsplit command tool to trim a wmv vc1 and I've noticed there are artifacts at the point of the cut when I specify the attribute accuracy="frame" in the xtl.  I was wondering if this is normal due to cutting at a non keyframe.  When I trim an mp4 avc file instead, there are no artifacts and seems to be frame accurate.  I know I can use GOP accuracy on the wmv but I prefer frame with no artifacts if possible.

Also, how come the attribute 'accuracy' for the track element in the xtl is not documented?  Are there other attributes not documented?

Thanks.
Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: Stanislav Mikhailenko on May 16, 2012, 05:10:30 PM
Hello snapcoyote,

could you specify more info about the problem?

full version info of the video splitter installation.
If you will upload file and xtl it will speed up resolution.
Also i need to know which version of OS do you use. + if it's XP which version of Windows Media Player is installed.

Quote
Also, how come the attribute 'accuracy' for the track element in the xtl is not documented?  Are there other attributes not documented?
Yes,  "Batch File Format" in help file need to be updated. Latest one is in SolveigMM Video Editing SDK (http://www.solveigmm.com/en/products/video-editing-sdk/).


Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: snapcoyote on May 17, 2012, 11:24:58 AM
Hi.  I am using version:

Installation version 3. 0. 1204. 17
Version 3. 0. 1204. 23

I tried my test on Windows 7 with media player 12 as well as Windows Server 2008 with media player 11 and both produced the same issue.

I think it has to do with how my start/stop times are specified in the xtl.  In the xtl reference, the stop/stop is in hh:mm:ss.ff format, where hh = hours, mm = minutes, ss = seconds, and ff = fractions of seconds. Example: 1:04:30.512.

When I specify the fractions greater than 0, the cuts become more distorted where as if I specified .00 fractions, it is less noticeable.

Here are my test files:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3426455/sample.zip

Thanks.
Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: Dmitry Vergeles on May 17, 2012, 09:47:25 PM
Hi snapcoyote,

Could you please let us know your real name to identify your purchase (as we only support registered users)?
Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: snapcoyote on May 17, 2012, 11:33:54 PM
Hi.  It is registered under National Basketball Association.
Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: Dmitry Vergeles on May 18, 2012, 01:07:38 AM
Hi.  It is registered under National Basketball Association.

Ok, thanks. We'll check an issue quite shortly. The easiest way to get a right XTL, is to configure your project in the Splitter (visually) and save the project.
Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: snapcoyote on May 18, 2012, 04:44:31 AM
I tried creating a more accurate XTL file by saving the project and it produced the same issue using both the visual Splitter and batchsplit tool.
Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: Olga Krovyakova on May 18, 2012, 04:47:57 PM
Hello snapcoyote,

Thank you for files.

The problem was reproduced.
We will let you know as soon as we'll find out its reason and fix it.
Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: Stanislav Mikhailenko on May 24, 2012, 12:17:24 PM
Hello snapcoyote,

i saw in headers that file was made by mainconcept vc1 encoder.
Did you make this file by yourself?
if so, could you provide us  for test encoder and settings which was set to it by e-mail?
Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: snapcoyote on May 25, 2012, 12:06:17 AM
Hi.

Here are the settings you requested.  It was created by an encoding server.  Let me know if it is enough for you to test.

Video
Format: VC-1
Format profile: Advanced@L1
Codec ID: WVC1
Codec ID/Hint: Microsoft
Description of the codec: MainConcept VC1 codec  - Advanced, progressive, 1 Mbps 1-Pass CBR
Bit rate: 1500 Kbps
Width: 640 pixels
Height: 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio: 4:3
Frame rate: 29.970 fps
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth: 8 bits
Scan type: Progressive
Compression mode: Lossy
Rate Control Mode: CBR
GOP Mode: Fixed
GOP Size: 30
Number of B Frames: 1
Closed GOP Cadence: 1
Adaptive Quantization: off
Scene change detection (inserts I-frames on scene changes): true


Audio
Format: WMA
Format version: Version 2
Codec ID/Info: Windows Media Audio
Description of the codec: MainConcept WMA Std codec  - WMA Std. 44100Hz 48 Kbps 2-ch 1-Pass CBR
Bit rate: 48.0 Kbps
Channel(s): 2 channels
Sampling rate : 44.1 KHz
Bit depth: 16 bits
Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: Stanislav Mikhailenko on May 28, 2012, 09:54:21 PM
hello snapcoyote,

The file with these parameters couldn' be partialy rencoded using Microsoft VC-1 Encoder, one of the reasons is EBDU start codes enabled.
But that's not main problem. there are other parameters that will break playback  if they wouldn't  match.

As a solution for this kind of files using this version SolveigMM Video Splitter 3.0 Beta (http://www.solveigmm.com/download/SolveigMM_Video_Splitter_3_0_Beta.exe)

You can select MainConcept VC1 Encoder for Smart Trimming option using Tools->Preferences, and set encoder parameters that will fit the source video.
(http://solveigmm.com/images/forum/Preferences.jpg)

The keys parameter which i set:
(http://solveigmm.com/images/forum/Object_Properties.jpg)
(http://solveigmm.com/images/forum/Object_Properties1.jpg)

The result file plays fine using Microsoft WM Video Decoder DMO. But using VLC Player the reencoded part is broken, I suppose that not all parameters that i set match source video.
Unfortunately, force selected  encoder active only for current session of the Video Splitter, and couldn't be set using XTL batch list.

Of course this question is not closed, because it's  hard  to work with this workaround.
Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: snapcoyote on May 30, 2012, 12:17:41 AM
Thanks for your reply.  Unfortunately, the splitter software is installed on a different machine so it only has the default microsoft codecs.  Only the encoding server has the Mainconcept VC1 codecs which is licensed to a vendor.

So it is not possible to partially encode using the default Microsoft VC1 Encoder when the file is encoded using Mainconcept?  Are there other available free VC1 codecs I can use that are compatible with Mainconcept?
Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: Stanislav Mikhailenko on May 30, 2012, 01:25:20 PM
Quote
So it is not possible to partially encode using the default Microsoft VC1 Encoder when the file is encoded using Mainconcept?
Not Exactly. It's possible, but with it's own parameters.
Check this version SolveigMM_Video_Splitter_3_0_1205_30_Beta (http://www.solveigmm.com/files/SolveigMM_Video_Splitter_3_0_1205_30_Beta.exe)
Trimmed file should play fine using Windows Media Player, WM Video Decoder, Mainconcept VC1 decoder.
But it crashes VLC player and hangs on ffdshow video decoder if libavcodec is set for VC1.

VC1 spec says that  sequence layer(decoding params) could be changed during the stream. so such files are valid, but for vlc and libavcodec seems it's not.

Quote
Are there other available free VC1 codecs I can use that are compatible with Mainconcept?
I don't think that it exists.

Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: snapcoyote on May 31, 2012, 03:32:33 AM
I'll try it out but I'm hoping there will be a better solution.  If not, I may have to use GOP accuracy instead.

There is one other thing I noticed when splitting VC1 files.  When I try accuracy mode GOP, the trimmed file plays and seeks fine in windows media player.  When I try to seek using vlc player, it takes a long time for vlc to seek within the file.
Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: Stanislav Mikhailenko on May 31, 2012, 12:07:30 PM
Conformed.
i'll investigate what's wrong.

Could you also tell what kind of encoder server is used and which version of Mainconcept encoder. I need to know complete intialization params which was set to encoder. Params that you wrote before is not enough.
Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: Stanislav Mikhailenko on June 02, 2012, 03:31:58 PM
Hello snapcoyote,

Here is version that resolves issue with seeking of trimmed file with GOP mode.
SolveigMM_Video_Splitter_3_0_1206_2_Beta (http://www.solveigmm.com/download/SolveigMM_Video_Splitter_3_0_Beta.exe)
Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: snapcoyote on June 04, 2012, 11:52:29 PM
Hi.  I tried the beta version with GOP mode and it does seem to seek better in vlc now.  However, it still does not play as cleanly as windows media player.  There is a short silence in the audio after the seek before it kicks in when I play in vlc.

I am still waiting for the vendor to respond to your Mainconcept initialization question and will let you know.
Title: Re: Frame accuracy trim on WMV shows artifacts
Post by: Stanislav Mikhailenko on June 05, 2012, 11:54:35 AM
Hello snapcoyote, as i see the source video before_split.wmv has the same pauses after seeking in vlc related to audio as the trimmed one. So I think  that it's not VideoSplitter problem. I'll try to find out why this happens.